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I seriously need some advice. Is it unrealistic to think that a child-parent sexual relationship is incestuous no matter if the “couple” is of legal age, the daughter is 18, same-sex, and the relationship was “mutually wanted?”
I have never been exposed to this specific issue: Mother and Daughter Come Out about Lesbian Relationship, it is an issue I had found on my Facebook feed from a person on my friend list, Sarah McCulloch. I don’t know Ms. McCulloch. What I do know is that she lives in the UK and this issue seems to be something familiar to the UK society.
Still I contend that it is incest and posting that fact: that it was incestuous, caused a fire storm. Many who posted on Ms. McCulloch’s feed was very supportive of the “couple”. Those who were supportive of this issue said they are a same-sex couple, of legal age, emotionally stable and “can’t reproduce so it’s OK.”
How could anyone think that any incestuous couple was anything but harmful! I think if we open ourselves to the idea that a harmful relationship is OK because they don’t reproduce is a slippery slope.
I would love to hear from David Pittman, Patricia McKnight who deal with victim’s of abuse and how they would have handled the posted thread that ensued. I have the thread here:
However, point still stands whether the particular story in this article is true or not. These guys are real: http://marriage-equality.blogspot.co.uk/…/why-i-started…
people concerned. A similar argument could apply to the power differential between two gay men/women surely…?Neither of those points are ethical points, nor do they affect anyone than the consenting parties involved and both arguments could be extended to, say, homosexual relationships (or other taboo but societally excepted relationship forms)
pretty much the same flaw when itis used again homosexuals. “Who’s the man and who’s the women” being cited far too often. It doesn’t work like that (at least for me). There is no power struggle because the individual make it work for them regardless of gender. Well these are two consenting adults who have made it work. If they claim it works for them then (just like any other adult consenting relationship where no other partiesare harmed) then who are we to judge or comment on this.And what about two lesbian sisters or gay brothers? I presume this is equally as “uncomfortable” to you on a personal level but the power dynamic argument is somewhat moot.
It is the use of a parental relationship in incestuous situations that makes the relationships more about power and control than love. We are conditioned to assume parental means authority and child dependence. To keep someone childlike is to keep them dependent on you for all their needs: “She does normal mom stuff: buys me clothes, pays for food, tells me to make our bed. We just happen to enjoy sex with each other too.”
We should be asking the question of why does this mother, or any parent, sibling, family relative would want to be in a relationship with a young relative? What is gained? What does the younger relative lose?
You are completely missing the point, it isn’t for you to pass judgment on others where no other party is harmed. I have been VERY clear that even if there is chance to conceive then it is wrong. You are questioning the dynamic but there are an entire plethora of relationships that host extraordinary dynamics. Three-Way “couples”, Four-Way “Couples”, bondage S&M relationships that can be quite extreme, etc. The world is full of relationships that aren’t conventional in a “power” sense so I do not accept that as a valid case.
I agree a parent has a responsibility to their child in so much as the child should feel loved and encouraged in their endeavors. HOWEVER, I am NOT talking about a “child” – parent incestuous relationship, I do not condone that. I am referring to TWO (or more) emotionally developed adults that are harming no other beings. IF they are making a mistake it is NOT for anybody else to tell them so.
How Spiritual Lives Of Women Can Help Nurture Moms
It’s FYI Wednesday and I have asked fellow Catholic moms for questions that they might have on such topics as motherhood and spirituality, children’s spiritual development, finding time for yourself, or just to learn more about Spiritual Direction; here is the latest question asked by Megan:
I don’t know what is going on in the world.
The Ferguson crisis, ISIS’ brutality. My world in both the microcosm and macrocosm is in a state of disorder. We need to bring back the good and the peace.
The world does seem to be in disarray, and the problems so large that they are overwhelming, but God does not ask us to solve them alone. He asks us to pray for our enemies, work toward creating the Kingdom (fight for a righteous cause), live the greatest commandment: Love God + Love Our Nieghbours + As we love ourselves. There is a key here, an important one: How well do we love; how positive, (Christlike) are we in our thoughts, words and actions.
We should look at our gifts and talents, see what we can do; some are more political and go for the larger problems: think Globally act Locally. Others focus on the community: Teachers come to mind a difficult vocation helping encourage/mold the minds of our youth, and moms who are baptized to be Priest = Nurturer + Prophet = First/Greatest Teacher + Queen = Guide/Partner/Co-“Ruler”
Megan God is in his heaven, and all will be right with the world
Did you know that in Tanzania, people who have Albinism, (commonly know as ‘Ablbino’), are segregated, brutalized, sexually assaulted, or even murdered. ~ from HODGEPODGE 4 THE SOUL™ I didn’t either.
As a woman and a mom I am speaking to you fellow mom, fellow believer. We are all connected one to the other by the simple fact that God wants us to be so: The Greatest Commandment, so, it important for us to learn about the world around, and not just the issues that shout the loudest, but the quiet/silent ones.
It seems that in Tanzania there is a great deal of fear and superstition about the “other.” In a population where there is little opportunity for education superstition fills in the gaps, and here the idea of those who have Albinism as the “other” is an ancient one. And by making them the “other” it allows people to treat them as non-human. Those with Albinism have been raped and killed. The tradition has it that the skin, body parts of someone with Albinism is very powerful for shamanistic arts.
So, is God calling you to take some action on this cause?
Sunday was the Twentieth Sunday in Ordinary Time, and the Gospel reading was of the Canaanite woman with an ill daughter. Now, what was so interesting about this Sunday, was that I was at a church that is far more conservative than I am. I seldom go to this church for Mass because I find that the spiritual conservationism can make me quite upset, and I hate being upset in Mass.
I remember expressing this opinion to my eldest son, and he said something insightful, he said: “Mom, the priest isn’t here to make you happy, he is here to make you think.” Fair enough. This Sunday what the pastor was saying sounded about as far away from good thinking as anyone can get, it was fire and brimstone which, as far as I am concerned, does not nothing but set up a vicious cycle of spiritual condemnation and worthlessness.
Father equated the “evil one” with the Gospel, for me it was a huge leap, but he forced it to work. Now here is where I have a problem with what he said.
First off, why are we calling the devil the “evil one“? Why give the devil more power by making the use of his name a talisman. If we begin to the fear the name we increase the fear and therefore the power of the devil, we give power to the devil. We have in essence, by increasing our fear, opened ourselves to the devil. Doesn’t the devil work through fear?
Secondly, isn’t it true that Christ rebuked the devil and therefore gave us the same power? After all in an exorcism this very power is used to rebuke and turn away the devil. We can not rebuke and turn away Christ, we can reject him but not rebuke him. If this is true, who has the greater power: Christ or the devil; Christ of course.
Thirdly, the devil is a rebellious angel, who thrives on crisis of faith, deals in death of soul, mind and spirit, corrupts positive individualism, (God’s creation of us as individuals with gifts and talents which we use in our mission with Christ-Baptism), distorts free will, and brings destruction to life, spirituality and emotion.
The devil works through man, is invited by man, creates in man a nature of hate; so why does Father seem to be saying that we have no power over the devil? Does it make sense that we throw our hands up in the air and say: “Well, we can’t do anything about it the devil is too powerful!” That can be what you take away from what Father was saying. Evil in the middle east, Ferguson, Mo, nothing we can do about it all the devil’s fault! Really, Father, really!
I for one believe in Christ and put on the full armor of Christ! There is a great article by Maximilian “Catholic Tools” Kolbe on the very subject of binding spirits/the devil. Here is an excerpt:
This may sound outlandish or even like you might not have any authority to say these words. But these simple words are extremely powerful.
For example how many times have you received communion and never felt like anything happened. If we truly knew what we are receiving than how much greater would we prepare for Mass and how much more would that Mass effect our life. In the same sense just because these words might not elicit a big theatrical scene, they still wage war against the Devil.
All Christians have the authority to bind evil spirits in Christ’s name (Mk, 16:17). Binding an evil spirit is using the Authority of Jesus Christ and His power to make the evil spirit stop what ever it is doing and not to make any further progress. It is silencing the spirit. Rebuking is taking authority over the evil spirit and stopping it, too.
When you command in the name of Jesus Christ you are telling the spirit to be disposed of by Jesus. One is not doing any of this with their own power, but the power of Jesus Christ. More of the article here
So, now we come to evil in the world. If you have the attitude of oh well can’t do anything the devil is in the world; than what’s going to stop you from giving up spiritually? Don’t/aren’t we seeing that everyday when people say things like: “Oh it’s too big a problem for me.” “The world is going to hell in a hand-basket.” “What can I do, I’m only one person!”
As our pastor always tells us when we think the same things, he reminds us of what his spiritual director tells him: “Get over yourself, God Needs You!”
What can you do? Pray. Work toward a righteous cause. Educate yourself on the problem. Write your congress person. We want change right now, ain’t gonna happen. We have to work for change and when the change comes work to keep it.
It’s too big for you, maybe but how ’bout a group of you?
Hand-basket and hell, only if we give up.
So, here’s the question: You going to give up?